Rolling stock

Rodger Bradley   02/03/2018 at 09:24

This is a great idea, and Siemens already have works in the Hull area for the offshore industry. However, is it true that this project is dependent on the company receiving large orders - either new build or maintenance?

Andrew Gwilt   02/03/2018 at 09:37

At least the North of England will see more jobs created with new trains being built. Brilliant news. Siemens could manufacture more new Desiro City and Desiro rolling stocks including the Bi-Mode and Electric. Aswell maintaining the current Desiro’s-Class 185’s, Class 350’s and Class 360’s. And the Class 700’s, Class 707’s and Class 717’s Desiro City fleets that could also be maintained at the new Siemens train manufacturing plant. With Class 444’s and Class 450’s DC Desiro that are maintained at SWR Southampton and Wimbledon Depots (including Class 707’s that are maintained at Wimbledon Depot). And the Thameslink Class 700’s that are maintained at Hornsey & Three Bridges Depots. Also. Is there any news or confirmation on Siemens that are to build & manufacture the brand new 25 6-Car Class 717’s that is to replace the 30+year old 3-Car Class 313’s on the Great Northern Moorgate and Hertford North Lines and Kings Cross-Welwyn GC services. And to transfer the remaining Class 313’s to Southern’s Coastway services. As Siemens have completed manufacturing the 30 Class 707’s for SWR.

Jimbo   02/03/2018 at 10:10

Yeah, this will depend on Siemens getting some big orders for new stock. The European train manufacturers have realised that after Brexit, they are going to need a local manufacturing (or at least, assembly) facility in the UK to be able to compete, particularly for HS2 trains. This is why Siemens talk about a phased development. The problem is that after the current orders are complete in 2021-22, there is going to be a glut of manufacturing capacity in the UK, even before this factory is built. The current & planned factories will be able to replace the entire UK train stock in around 15 years, which is no good when the vehicles are expected to last at least 25 years.There may be benefits in these manufacturers having a facility close to, but offshore from, the EU, but what impact that will have will remain a big unknown for a few years yet. This is why Siemens are talking about a phased development.

Jimbo   02/03/2018 at 10:16

@Andrew Gwilt - The 717's are already under constructions in Germany. This factory will be for orders that Siemens haven't got yet, because to get an order, they already need to have space to make them. Most likely, they have their eye on HS2 stock for this factory. Also, you don't need to list out every single Siemens built class in the UK. People here either already know this or can easily find it - this is the sort of comment that annoys many people here and I wish you would learn to not write out long lists of stuff.

Colin Sworder   02/03/2018 at 10:58

Siemens speak of manufacture. However, 'developing and commissioning' excludes the production which requires manufacturing skills, materials and supply chain. Useful though this investment will be, it would seem to be half a loaf.

Lutz   02/03/2018 at 11:29

Proposals, nothing definitive for phase of implementation. Numbers quoted would be for a full implementation if whatever that might be went ahead. There is perhaps a question around what impact this would have on existing sites - there are likely to be functions on existing sites that under consideration for consolidation at proposed Goole site. The location next to Stobart's is also interesting if a key consideration was the import/export of vehicle bodies.

Jak Jay   02/03/2018 at 12:06

Not more rancid EMU's please! the Thameslink/SWR ones are the most uncomfortable units...ever. And what will happen to Bombardier at Derby? can see this patriotic Euro obsessed Government piling up new train orders to CAF and Siemens to keep them sweet

Paul K   02/03/2018 at 12:29

This is good news. I wonder if there are any plans for a decent high speed test track to complement this development. Perhaps there could be a tie up with the proposed test track for Long Marston.

Billd   02/03/2018 at 12:29

What a good idea for Siemens to build a factory producing electric trains no-where near an electrified line! Even better to plan to produce HS2 captive stock no-where near a UIC gauge line! Full marks for the brains behind this scheme. Siemens should be limited to delivery by rail to and from any new factory to avoid even more traffic on unsuitable roads complete with additional road vehicle emissions.

Mikeb   02/03/2018 at 12:42

With CAF and TALGO also planning factories in the UK - and not forgetting Alstom who have spoken about new trains being built at Widnes - the country will see six factories all bidding for limited work in the domestic market. As all of these companies have production facilities throughout Europe and, like Hitachi and Bombardier, around the World, export potential will surely be limited. We could eventually see over-capacity and one or more factories may not survive.

Mark Hare   02/03/2018 at 12:45

Andrew - try actually reading the article before making ridiculous comments. The clue is in the first line: "aimed at developing and commissioning new rolling stock" - so clearly it will NOT be used for maintaining existing fleets. Also I'm not sure how you think a Depot at Goole will maintain EMU fleets when the line to Goole is not electrified.

John Webster   02/03/2018 at 13:25

Goole might seem at first to be an unlikely place to build a new train building facility until you look at it's geographic location :- (a) Close to Hull (so close to Europe etc.) (b) Brownfield site with rail connections so cheap to buy/lease.(c) Not too far from Doncaster so could siphon off some train-building expertise. Seems like a good idea to me!

Jimbo   02/03/2018 at 14:26

New stock rarely leaves the factory under its own power, so the lack of an electrified line isn't really relevant. They would just hire in a diesel to drag the stock to wherever it is going to be commissioned. I think the main criteria is that the land will be cheap to lease, so they can afford to reserve the location and not build anything until they have suitable orders.

Andrew Gwilt   02/03/2018 at 23:43

Mark Hare. You are just like Boris. Mr Captain Obvious.

Andrew JG   03/03/2018 at 13:37

Bi-Mode Desiro City and/or Bi-Mode Desiro trains to be manufactured at this new Siemens manufacturing plant in Goole. Including Bi-Mode Desiro City/Desiro for the Midland Main Line, North of England, Southwest and Wales. Aswell new rolling stocks for Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland. Whilst the current Siemens train manufacturing plant near Düsseldorf in Germany will continue to manufacture new trains for European countries including Germany, Netherlands, France, Italy, Sweden & other countries in Europe. And worldwide including Russia, China, India, Thailand, USA, Australia etc.

AJ. Gwilt   04/03/2018 at 00:35

At least Siemens will still continue to manufacture the last remaining Thameslink Class 700’s and to start production on manufacturing the 6-Car Class 717’s for Great Northern that will replace the Class 313’s and is soon to enter service possibly in late summer or late this year on the Moorgate line and Hertford Loop services (including Moorgate/KX-Letchworth and WGC). As all 30 Class 707’s have been built for SWR (despite being replaced by Class 701’s Aventras from next year-onwards).

Jimbo   04/03/2018 at 10:16

@Andrew Gwilt - are you deliberately trying to annoy everyone else who reads these articles? because that is what you are doing and you are ruining this site for other people. Just listing current Siemens stock does not make you look knowlegeable or clever, and using different names to make your comments just makes you look like a sad attention seeker. Just because the article has the trigger words "Siemens" and "New trains" is not a good reason for you to list out everything you know aboud Siemens trains. This factory is at least 2 years away from being ready, probably more because it is still beng planned and Siemens have not committed to actually building it - all they are doing is reserving a location for possibly building a factory in the future. It has nothing to do with current stock or existing orders, and Siemens have not said what stock they will build there. Lastly, instead of replying with a rude comment and a suggestion about being banned, try to learn why you are annoying people - you will be a much better person for it.

Andrew Gwilt   04/03/2018 at 11:37

@Jimbo. I ain’t even bothered to read your statement.

Jason   04/03/2018 at 20:21

More foreign trash?? Can't we build a factory that's non-foreign for once?

Overcapacity   05/03/2018 at 08:55

It will be interesting if this ever actually takes off as Alstom and Siemens are in the process of merging. Assuming this occurs on target by the end of 2018 would they still build a new factory from scratch if Alstom has 40% already built in Widnes? Can't see them ever running 2 factories in the UK. HS2 if won by Siemens or Alstom is likely to be a finished product that takes the best of each company.

Oliver Gwynne   05/03/2018 at 13:50

It's amazing how many planned developments happen just as people are bidding for contacts... You all seem more knowledgeable than me, but a genuine question. Hitachi basically assemble in the UK, Siemens currently manufacture in Germany from my understanding, do we think that this proposed plant will actually be making trains or is it likely to be another assembly plant just to win new orders?

Essexy Commuter   05/03/2018 at 13:57

Andrew Gwilt loves getting himself into multiple siemens. Who are we to stop his love?

Trainboy   05/03/2018 at 14:48

@Oliver, personally I think it will be a similar set up to Newton Aycliffe, as in final assembly and the ability to undertake heavy maintenance and refurbs. And I agree with your comment that it puts Siemens in a position where they can also start stating the job creation/security benefits of placing orders for new trains with them as opposed to Bombardier or Hitachi. I think the location is a good choice though, plenty of skilled railway people around Doncaster.

Mikeb   05/03/2018 at 23:56

@Jason. You must surely be aware that nowadays, all train builders are foreign. The last British train builders were absorbed into the likes of Alstom and Bombardier years ago so today, a non-foreign factory will sadly never be built.